Anonymous #2 3w

The human nature of self interest? We’ve always been extremely communal societies that rely upon each other to survive… power dynamics disappear when the material conditions change

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Anonymous OP 3w

Sure, to some extent where our self interest necessitates (food from agriculture, protection from predators via bigger grouping). However we never acted against our own self interest, in fact we would go against societal values to protect it.

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Anonymous #2 3w

Exactly, the incentives need to align with the interests

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Anonymous #2 3w

Our self interest IS communalism, exactly. It’s not mutually exclusive. Communalism is the opposite of disregarding our self interests, it’s our human nature and in the best interest of everyone

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Anonymous OP 3w

I think it's a pretty misguided belief to state that there is an "our self interest", it would imply that nobody's interests disagree with another's.

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Anonymous OP 3w

And personally, I think it's more in my interest to have a capitalist system than a communist one, I just think we need less intertwining of big business and the government.

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Anonymous #2 3w

It’s only in your interest if you’re part of the capital owning ruling class. Otherwise it completely contradicts your interests

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Anonymous OP 3w

The ruling class is the government, Bezos can't send bombs to the Middle East with impunity

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Anonymous #2 3w

No, the billionaire donor class is who our government is working for. They only give us small concessions so that we don’t revolt. And it’s not about one individual billionaire but the collective interests of the billionaire class

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Anonymous OP 3w

So your real problem with the capitalist system is political donations?

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Anonymous #2 3w

What? No…. It’s class warfare. The working class’ interests inherently contradict the ruling class’ interests. We need to seize the means of production to change that. That’s like the most simple way of explaining why capitalism will never work for the ppl

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Anonymous OP 3w

I think my interests conflict a lot more with giving more powers to government than most wealthy people

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Anonymous #2 3w

It’s not about giving more power to the government, it’s about the PEOPLE taking over the government and collectively serving everyone’s interests to the best of their ability. Instead of a few rich guys.. why wouldn’t you want that

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Anonymous OP 3w

My interests clearly already conflict with yours in a lot of ways so I don't see how adding more people to the equation is going to make that any less true

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Anonymous #2 3w

If you can root out corruption and provide transparency like some countries in Europe have, it can work. But rooting out corruption almost seems to require a cultural shift, not just a better government framework to get rid of it

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Anonymous #2 3w

How do our interests conflict? Are your interests not stable and safe housing, access to healthcare, access to food and water, healthy relationships, and living in safe and connected communities that help each other out? Or do you want to be super rich and hoard wealth, mansions, cars etc at the expense of others? If your interests align with the ruling class when you’re not part of it, you’re just fucking yourself over and bring a bootlicker to your own demise

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Anonymous OP 3w

*being a bootlicker

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Anonymous OP 3w

Obviously it's in my best interest to live in a mansion, have a bunch of cars, and be wealthy. Why would I need government intervention for stuff I already have?

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Anonymous OP 3w

Bro really threw in healthy relationships too lol maybe try getting off yikyak and talking to people in real life

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Anonymous #2 3w

Ew so you just want to be an oppressor and steal from others. Gross. You’re right, our interests don’t align then. I thought you were at least a normal compassionate human being who wants the best for everyone but ig not. You’re just selfish

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Anonymous #2 3w

I have healthy relationships what 😭 been thru lots of therapy and self work. Capitalism tries to isolate us from each other. Hence why I needed therapy

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Anonymous OP 3w

Is the capitalism in the room with us right now telling you to isolate yourself?

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Anonymous #2 3w

You really don’t understand how individualism inherently isolates us from each other and ultimately serves capitalism so that everything can be commodified? Open the schools Jesus

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Anonymous OP 3w

How does having a mansion and luxury cars necessarily mean you’re an oppressor who stole from people?

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Anonymous #3 3w

If you’re hoarding mansions and cars then you most definitely own private property in some way. Which steals from the worker’s labor value to make a profit

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Anonymous OP 3w

Is my house and my backyard not private property?

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Anonymous OP 3w

Lmao so you're one of those. I'll consider buying into this when you give up the private property you're typing this on

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Anonymous #3 3w

Nope that’s personal property. Private property is something you profit from

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Anonymous #2 3w

I don’t have any private property, I’m not a landlord, farm owner, own a company or have employees. You’re thinking of personal property

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Anonymous OP 3w

I'm almost certain that you're the one misunderstanding the definition of private property here. Do you own anything? Then you have private property.

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Anonymous OP 3w

I don’t believe Marx ever made this distinction

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Anonymous #2 3w

They mean in the Marxist sense, not the US legal system

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Anonymous #2 3w

You’ve really never heard of the distinction between private and personal property? That means you’ve done absolutely no research into socialism. How can your position stand firm when you’re basing your beliefs off vibes instead of history and research? I’m not going to engage with someone who doesnt even comprehend the basics of anti capitalism and what it entails. Open some books Yeah i own plenty of items. Ofc. Theyre my personal property. I dont profit off my personal property

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Anonymous #2 3w

Like no one is trying to steal your toothbrush or shoes dude 😭

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Anonymous OP 3w

But if I wanted to sell my toothbrush it somehow becomes your business?

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